After BB patch 5 int = 1 mag att

basilmarket.com forums : Cleric to Bishop | 15 posts archived

thread starter kapoweee Aug 17 2010 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

so recently my friend brought up that apparently the reason lukless bishops will suck is not the accuracy which isnt even that bad like I had thought but that it will take 5 int for 1 mag att. If this is the case then I'd assume that low luk would be better as you can equipt wepons with greater magic att and I'd be screwed. Can anyone on basil cofirm or denny this, because if its true i may have to start pumping some points in luk

My Characters: Kanz101 - 127 Bera Bishop

dshortkid93 08/17/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

buy luck equips. im lukless and i can wear my reverse aeas hand easily

My Characters: mrheei - 141 Broa Bishop

khrono 08/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

can anyone confirm or deny this claim? would like to know

Happy2Days 08/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

o.o my base luk is 45 and with MW +equips it's 98... don't know if that's ok >< someone check it out please

My Characters: FFxLarsa - 158 Bera Bishop

Gutanaclone + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

They're making M.Atk just like atk? Ew. But doesn't that mean that the PUACs and M.ATK earrings will be really good? :/ And either way, other jobs make it fine being statless, I think it'd be the same for mages.

My Characters: NigPlesh - 54 Windia Cleric

vivid44 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

wrong. here is the formula. magic att will now have range. to calculate your max range, do this. MAX RANGE = ((INT*4)+LUK)*(MagicAtt)/100) To calculate minimum, do this. (Mastery skills is for example, say shining ray is at level 30, its mastery is 60% (you can see this in game now), so it would be .60 where mastery skills is.) MIN RANGE = (.25+Mastery skills)*Max SO, heres an example, my int right now is about 750. my luk is at 4. my magic att is somewhere around 120. lets calculate. ((750*4)+4)*(120/100) 3004*1.2 =3600 (max range) for a regular luk mage, and correct me if im wrong, it would be about 600 int right now, luk would be at about 150, and magic att maybe 140? i have no idea, i dont have a luk mage. you can do it yourself. but damage is still in favor of the lukless. this is because luk has no multiplier, it is only being added onto int, which is x4. you can no longer say the 1int = 1m.a. because our damage will be shown in range just like a warrior's. and based on the new formula that will be in the big bang update, lukless mages will have an even larger damage margin over regular luk builds. anything that people say in game about how "oh youre gonna suck after the big bang patch, they are nerfing lukless mages LOL, is completely false, obviously they havnt compared theyre new M.A. formula with a lukless mage's. i hope that solves your dilemma. Note: I HAVE MODIFIED THE NEW FORMULAS TO SUIT MAGES ONLY FOR SIMPLICITY TO THE THREAD STARTER. IF YOU USE THESE ON A DIFFERENT CLASS, IT WILL BE WRONG. REPEAT: BIG BANG FORMULA FOR MAGES ONLY. Edit: Here is a direct comparison of the max range of luk mages VS lukless mages at lvl 50. Given that you have around 250 ap to spend at lvl 50, luk mages would have luk at 53 and int at 197, and lukless mages would have luk at 4 and int at 250. We are going to assume that both mages have 60 magic att weapons for the sake of argument of whether having luk will be beneficial to your damage or not. LUK MAGE ((197*4)+53)*(60/100) 841*0.60 =504 max damage vs. LUKLESS MAGE ((250*4)+4)*(60/100) 1000*0.60 602 max damage. as you can see, lukless mages will have about 100 damage difference by level 50 depending on equipment. i truly hope that this ends all the crap. seriously.

My Characters: ViVidx4 - 148 Bera Bishop

kapoweee 08/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

Thanks alot Vivid that really clears things up :D

My Characters: Kanz101 - 127 Bera Bishop

ErrorCode + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] vivid44 : wrong. here is the formula. magic att will now have range. to calculate your max range, do this. MAX RANGE = ((INT*4)+LUK)*(MagicAtt)/100) To calculate minimum, do this. (Mastery skills is for example, say shining ray is at level 30, its mastery is 60% (you can see this in game now), so it would be .60 where mastery skills is.) MIN RANGE = (.25+Mastery skills)*Max SO, heres an example, my int right now is about 750. my luk is at 4. my magic att is somewhere around 120. lets calculate. ((750*4)+4)*(120/100) 3004*1.2 =3600 (max range) for a regular luk mage, and correct me if im wrong, it would be about 600 int right now, luk would be at about 150, and magic att maybe 140? i have no idea, i dont have a luk mage. you can do it yourself. but damage is still in favor of the lukless. this is because luk has no multiplier, it is only being added onto int, which is x4. you can no longer say the 1int = 1m.a. because our damage will be shown in range just like a warrior's. and based on the new formula that will be in the big bang update, lukless mages will have an even larger damage margin over regular luk builds. anything that people say in game about how "oh youre gonna suck after the big bang patch, they are nerfing lukless mages LOL, is completely false, obviously they havnt compared theyre new M.A. formula with a lukless mage's. i hope that solves your dilemma. Note: I HAVE MODIFIED THE NEW FORMULAS TO SUIT MAGES ONLY FOR SIMPLICITY TO THE THREAD STARTER. IF YOU USE THESE ON A DIFFERENT CLASS, IT WILL BE WRONG. REPEAT: BIG BANG FORMULA FOR MAGES ONLY. Edit: Here is a direct comparison of the max range of luk mages VS lukless mages at lvl 50. Given that you have around 250 ap to spend at lvl 50, luk mages would have luk at 53 and int at 197, and lukless mages would have luk at 4 and int at 250. We are going to assume that both mages have 60 magic att weapons for the sake of argument of whether having luk will be beneficial to your damage or not. LUK MAGE ((197*4)+53)*(60/100) 841*0.60 =504 max damage vs. LUKLESS MAGE ((250*4)+4)*(60/100) 1000*0.60 602 max damage. as you can see, lukless mages will have about 100 damage difference by level 50 depending on equipment. i truly hope that this ends all the crap. seriously. [/quote] Yet, look at what weapons a Bishop will have. Obviously, a Reverse Hand or even a Marine will have a lot more magic attack than a Wisdom with the same scrolling. At level 200: A lukless Bish with 1k int and 4 luk wearing a clean Wisdom: 3203.2 max. ((1000*4)+4)*(80/100) A low luk Bish with 920 int and 80 luk wearing a clean Aeas Hand: 5076 max. ((920*4)+80)*(135/100) A low luk Bish with 920 int and 80 luk wearing a clean Blue Marine (For the unfunded): 4136 max. ((920*4)+80)*(110/100) Obviously, that's huge. Magic attack on equips may close the gap a little, but low luk Bishops will have more options. (Especially with potential stuff out.) Int =/= m.att now, like you said. However, it's M.att > Int, not Int>M.att

My Characters: Darksamus93 - 155 Broa Bishop

Xylit + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] vivid44 : for a regular luk mage, and correct me if im wrong, it would be about 600 int right now, luk would be at about 150, and magic att maybe 140? [/quote] HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. God you're misinformed, tell me what bishops would have 150 luk when the best weapon for us would have 123 luk requirement? With zhelm HTP and etc a bishop wouldnt need more than 60~70 luk, tops. And on top of that a clean wisdom got 80 m.att, a clean reverse which can be makered is 135 m.att. That's about a good 55~ or more due to maker, difference. On top of that level 71+ items get a bigger bonus from potential than items below it does = Having 71+ mage items = low luk = better. All in all true lukless using shine wands and wisdom staves are dying. Or atleast it's the weakest of the builds soon, tho cheapest. Being lukless with luk gear is stupid since you should never trade int gear for luk gear. Now redo your math with prober calcs, mhkay? All in all lowluk with reverse aeas = The strongest way for a bishop.

My Characters: AzureStar - 178 KradiaEMS Bishop

chickenpoodl + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

lukless with luk gear in the right places is the strongest. luk overall is good because luk and int for overalls go 1:1 statwise. luk shield vs matk shield is stupid because luk and matk scrolls do not give 1:1 stats. 60's give 2luk, 70/60's for matk give 3 stats. luk earrings is stupid. similar story to shield scrolls. luk cape is a great idea. 1:1 luk belt is cool too. 1:1 luk shoes isn't a bad way to go. can't really scroll tehse for anything other than maker skill + chaos. eyewhere is cool if you can chaso something tha tworks. finally we factor get potentiality scrolls. you should potential everything and anything for % int and % magic and % dmg or whatever. no where should you ever want a hard luk stat from your potnetial lines. as i said about, if you can get thos ething working, you should be in awesome shape while retaining "lukless" stat wise (4 or 23base @200) 4base + 15helm + 22htp + 10belt + 8shoe +12cape = 71luk already. 9 luk overall anyone? to equip a DDS. rofl if you can crank out a 30 luk overall, you're at 101 luk. factor in broken glasses, maybe 2luk clean, your'e at 103 luk. if you plan on 200, you can factor in 23 base luk. add in the 19 and you got 122 luk. be creative and you got 123 luk. thats for a revrse staff. or stop at 120 for a reverse wand. then you can even include in scrolling wedding ring with luk accessory scrolls, or acient thought rings, or even aura rings... all in all, youd ont' gotta listen to ppl who say "low luk is best" it depends on what you can work with and waht you got to mix-and-match. granted, lukless stats with luk gear = low luk in my books, but to some its only stat-wise that matter. the true lukless ppl are 4 base luk with all pure int gear, ending up with about 50ish luk. getting to 120 or 123 luk for reverse while staying at 4-23 base luk is ezpz now. even easier to get only 80-120 for some other weapon of their choice such as teh DDS. what i described is best. you get the most int base for mw bonuses, thus boosting your existing % gains from gear. you get your luk REQ for the bigger weapons. and.. um. ya thats it.

My Characters: ch0c0l8 - 197 Bera Bishop

Gutanaclone 08/19/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] chickenpoodl : lukless with luk gear in the right places is the strongest. luk overall is good because luk and int for overalls go 1:1 statwise. luk shield vs matk shield is stupid because luk and matk scrolls do not give 1:1 stats. 60's give 2luk, 70/60's for matk give 3 stats. luk earrings is stupid. similar story to shield scrolls. luk cape is a great idea. 1:1 luk belt is cool too. 1:1 luk shoes isn't a bad way to go. can't really scroll tehse for anything other than maker skill + chaos. eyewhere is cool if you can chaso something tha tworks. finally we factor get potentiality scrolls. you should potential everything and anything for % int and % magic and % dmg or whatever. no where should you ever want a hard luk stat from your potnetial lines. as i said about, if you can get thos ething working, you should be in awesome shape while retaining "lukless" stat wise (4 or 23base @200) 4base + 15helm + 22htp + 10belt + 8shoe +12cape = 71luk already. 9 luk overall anyone? to equip a DDS. rofl if you can crank out a 30 luk overall, you're at 101 luk. factor in broken glasses, maybe 2luk clean, your'e at 103 luk. if you plan on 200, you can factor in 23 base luk. add in the 19 and you got 122 luk. be creative and you got 123 luk. thats for a revrse staff. or stop at 120 for a reverse wand. then you can even include in scrolling wedding ring with luk accessory scrolls, or acient thought rings, or even aura rings... all in all, youd ont' gotta listen to ppl who say "low luk is best" it depends on what you can work with and waht you got to mix-and-match. granted, lukless stats with luk gear = low luk in my books, but to some its only stat-wise that matter. the true lukless ppl are 4 base luk with all pure int gear, ending up with about 50ish luk. getting to 120 or 123 luk for reverse while staying at 4-23 base luk is ezpz now. even easier to get only 80-120 for some other weapon of their choice such as teh DDS. what i described is best. you get the most int base for mw bonuses, thus boosting your existing % gains from gear. you get your luk REQ for the bigger weapons. and.. um. ya thats it. [/quote] I dont know much about post-big bang, but.. is it really worth it, to get all those luke equips and sacrifice int, just for and extra 50-ish magic atk from the staff?

My Characters: NigPlesh - 54 Windia Cleric

ErrorCode 08/19/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] Gutanaclone : I dont know much about post-big bang, but.. is it really worth it, to get all those luke equips and sacrifice int, just for and extra 50-ish magic atk from the staff? [/quote] 50 magic attack will be worth a lot after the BB patch. Of course, if you're middle class like me, getting a 31 luk overall and waiting until level 200 for that extra 19 luk can get incredibly tedious. It's not like having some base luk is completely wrong, as it does allow equipment flexibility. Do what you think will work for you. Every build has it's pros and cons, so there isn't a perfect one.

My Characters: Darksamus93 - 155 Broa Bishop

chickenpoodl + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

you're not sacrificing int. you lose 70-80 int with luk gear rather than int... but you are gaining HUNDREDS OF INT with % stats form potentiality scrolls. but at the same time you also now have the big LUK required for those big harder hitting weapons such as the kage, magicodar, doomsday, dragon staff, and of course the reverse wand and staff... equip int doens't give you MW int bonuses. base luk makes you lose MW int bonuses. so i mean to me, obviously putting equip luk and base int is the mroe beneficial combination.... lol

My Characters: ch0c0l8 - 197 Bera Bishop

ErrorCode 08/19/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] chickenpoodl : you're not sacrificing int. you lose 70-80 int with luk gear rather than int... but you are gaining HUNDREDS OF INT with % stats form potentiality scrolls. but at the same time you also now have the big LUK required for those big harder hitting weapons such as the kage, magicodar, doomsday, dragon staff, and of course the reverse wand and staff... equip int doens't give you MW int bonuses. base luk makes you lose MW int bonuses. so i mean to me, obviously putting equip luk and base int is the mroe beneficial combination.... lol [/quote] Reword that, please...? Using base luck is an easier path to take. No Bishop gets to 200 for the damage (At least after the BB patch). The damage is for getting to 200 sooner. If you're rich and really want that extra damage at 200, your build would work better.

My Characters: Darksamus93 - 155 Broa Bishop

chickenpoodl 08/20/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

rofl? the whole point of that big bang rebalance nonsense crap was FOR damage. LOL. effort to obtain power post-bigbang is easier than pre-bigbang. if you're worrying about gear and luk base and high matk weapons, YOU ARE CONCERNED WITH DAMAGE. dont' give me taht BS about "no bishop gets to 200 for damage/getting to 200 sooner" everyone wants more dmg for wahtever reason, be it to 1hit newties or 1hit more of whats in time temple. damage is irrelevant for training. its so easy to 1hit skele now its no longer a matter of anyones concern. of course base luk is easier. if the easy route is the route you wanan take, go ahead. the way i see it is, is if you're gonna play a character adn be concerend with the way its set up, might as wel do it to the best of your ability. i apologize if i offend you lol. i'm looking at it from teh same persepctiev as i did wen i was working on a dark knight which was at the top of its class in its time lol. i treat every character i play the same. if i'm goign to be spending time on something, i'll do the best i can at it, be it work, or play.

My Characters: ch0c0l8 - 197 Bera Bishop