LUKless vs LUK repeat threads

basilmarket.com forums : Mage | 15 posts archived

thread starter Beggy Feb 13 2010 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

This is ridiculous. Obviously a sticky that gives a specific, accurate, objective and most importantly unbiased comparison of LUKless and LUK mages is required. Surely the regulars of the Mage forums are sick and tired of having to regurgitate the same old shiet over and over again to clueless noobs who can't look past the first thread on the first page and think that their case is unique when it isn't and can be easily solved using a general solution, what with mages being so goddamn simple in the first place. Unless you derive some sort of pleasure from repeating "lukless = better" over and over again. If someone wants to write one then sure, I'll give what input I can. If they don't then whatever, I don't have the patience to write one myself without it being full of unbelievably condescending and snide comments about how stupid your average basiler is. Ravkins list is biased to hell against LUK users btw, so don't suggest that either.

My Characters: Gobbins - 166 Scania I/L Arch Mage

SourDonut 02/13/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

I 100% agree with you. I just thought of doing that a few days ago, but I'm not sure if it will be stickied, seeing how Elu's guide is still stickied and NEVER updated.

My Characters: SourDonut - 157 Broa I/L Arch Mage

DeMagH + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

i think the huge difference between low-luk and lukless mages can be simplified in the following: - low-luk tends to wear luk equips/overall to overcome the lack of luck to wear weapons, but lukless tends to wear int equips to maximize damage - the AP difference 21~ 40 int IMO this thread should be a lukless VS low-luk screen shot comparison between them both without meditation/maple warrior and the first post should be used to collect data + screen shot, how about that?

My Characters: LuklessDeM - 134 Scania I/L Arch Mage

Beggy + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

They can both be stickied right? The FAQ would be more general while the stickied LUK vs LUKless comparison thread would be more specifically geared to any potential question regarding mage AP builds. Edit: a general solution of how much extra INT/Matk a LUK user would require on equips to match a LUKless of the same level in Matk value is (base LUK-4) extra Matk and/or INT. For example if a LUKless has 1150 Matk total with 970 (900+70) INT an 80 base LUK user of the same level would require an extra 76 (80-4) Matk and/or INT to match the LUKless' Matk value AS WELL AS having the total LUK required for whatever weapon/equips they're using. This can be used, along with some remedial market research, to gauge the extra funding you'd require as a LUK user to match up to a LUKless of the same level. MW is a small bonus from being LUKless of anywhere between 0 to 16 extra INT depending on how early or late a similar levelled LUK user capped their LUK. Why anyone would cap at anything past 11x LUK is beyond me, but it must be taken into account for it to be unbiased. A screenshot comparison would basically be the Magic Ranges thread redux if several people contribute. Should ideally only deal with the numbers.

My Characters: Gobbins - 166 Scania I/L Arch Mage

oresama 02/13/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

I'm too lazy to write such a guide as well. irony ftw? We're too lazy to write guides-- lower level mages too lazy to look them up O_o

My Characters: hierou - 130 Broa I/L Arch Mage

Cambridge 02/13/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

I could never be stuffed

My Characters: eOke - 134 Scania I/L Arch Mage

Beggy + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

Laziness gets no-one anywhere. Someone must make the first move for action to occur. If the thread existed in blue at the top of the screen, maybe people would pay attention to it. If anyone makes a repeat thread, can just link to it instead of having to type stuff out repeatedly. Less effort is expended over time if a sticky on the subject existed.

My Characters: Gobbins - 166 Scania I/L Arch Mage

Peechyboy69 02/13/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

It's simple: Lukless > anything more than 5 luk unless you are level 196+ and have insane equips.

My Characters: Methphisto - 50 Scania F/P Wizard

Beggy + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

Wrong, given a sufficient funding advantage a LUK user of any level can achieve a higher Matk value than a LUKless. Your argument is oversimplifying the issue and is, more importantly, invalid. There's a reason why a LUKless build is advised for new mages who are starting out and are unfunded. Funding is extremely important.

My Characters: Gobbins - 166 Scania I/L Arch Mage

gmharri + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

*looks at topic* *looks at half-done guide* *looks at topic* *looks at cewkies* ... *5min later* ... What were we talking about? >=D I would be tempted to finish it, but like you say, that fossil of a guide isn't moving, so unless someone up top issues a reason for people to make guides because the old ones... are old, its going to sit there for a while longer.

My Characters: CobaltRieka - 118 Galicia Aran in Misery

Beggy + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

Why must you wait for "someone up top"? It's blatantly obvious that there is need for such a sticky, anyone who's worth beans as a moderator would see the need for it what with the sheer number of repeat threads made daily. It's obvious the old sticky isn't fulfilling it's purpose any longer and needs to either be updated or deleted. A forum is for discussion, not repetition of old "tried and tested" ideas in every single thread that calls for it. The number of "unfinished" guides you guys have made is surprising. If someone completes a decent LUKless and LUK user comparison that is numerically correct, that all the regulars agree with and there's enough support for it (as in, it gets bumped regularly as it's seen as something new mages should read by the people who read the Mage forum), what else can a mod do other than sticky something that could potentially clean out a fair portion of redundant threads that are currently abundant in this section? Unless Basil likes repeating itself (I don't think the posters on basil like repeating themselves judging by the number of half finished guides you guys have allegedly written, but bleh), in which case I'm wasting my time.

My Characters: Gobbins - 166 Scania I/L Arch Mage

gmharri 02/13/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] Beggy : Why must you wait for "someone up top"? It's blatantly obvious that there is need for such a sticky, anyone who's worth beans as a moderator would see the need for it what with the sheer number of repeat threads made daily. It's obvious the old sticky isn't fulfilling it's purpose any longer and needs to either be updated or deleted. A forum is for discussion, not repetition of old "tried and tested" ideas in every single thread that calls for it. The number of "unfinished" guides you guys have made is surprising. If someone completes a decent LUKless and LUK user comparison that is numerically correct, that all the regulars agree with and there's enough support for it (as in, it gets bumped regularly as it's seen as something new mages should read by the people who read the Mage forum), what else can a mod do other than sticky something that could potentially clean out a fair portion of redundant threads that are currently abundant in this section? Unless Basil likes repeating itself (I don't think the posters on basil like repeating themselves judging by the number of half finished guides you guys have allegedly written, but bleh), in which case I'm wasting my time. [/quote] There have been guides finished in the past, but they have just been ignored, I've seen so many pass by, I've lost all motivation, knowing that it will just sit there for a few days, go un-noticed then vanish into the depths of the archives. If Mr.Basil put up a notice that he wanted to update/make new guides etc. then I'd be more than happy to get back to work, knowing that it could end up being stickied to be noticed. Its not so much I care about it BEING stickied, but to spend hours making a guide, that vanishes in a shorter time than it took to make it... is depressing, if I'm going to use my time to make a guide, I want to know people will use THEIR time to actually use it, or at least keep it near the top of the mage forum so that you don't have countless posts everyday asking if their and idiot or an idiot. =-o

My Characters: CobaltRieka - 118 Galicia Aran in Misery

Beggy + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

I'd happily bump a LUKless and LUK comparison thread if I thought it was a good one. I thought the last one that was made sucked ("shmexys guide to luk vs lukless" or something), so I let it sink :x Could take it to the site forum if the mods and such don't pay attention to it here. I assume that's what the site forum is for, issues with the site in general right? But the need for updated/improved informative stickies (the magic range thread seems to be doing fine) is overwhelmingly large in the Mage section of Basil, maybe in other sections too. Even mr. basil should be able to see that. 'kay brb can't camp this thread all day >_<

My Characters: Gobbins - 166 Scania I/L Arch Mage

gmharri 02/13/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

I may try and get a bit of work done on it, but your definately right about guides on basil... http://www.basilmarket.com/MapleStory/Guides.html ...A cash shop price list guide...someone tell me they've used it...I have a lifetime to wait... >=3 Also what are the header and everything tags for basil? [br]?[/br] [hr]?[/hr] =o

My Characters: CobaltRieka - 118 Galicia Aran in Misery

Toughy + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

Didn't ravkin write one before? He had all these comparison and math input... I remember reading it but I don't remember when

My Characters: Toughanator - 146 Mardia I/L Arch Mage