Why are we shadowers so low in the bb Dpm chart!

basilmarket.com forums : Big Bang | 15 posts archived

thread starter Emoturd Oct 06 2010 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

We are like 13 - 16 th on the big bang chart I thought we were good! On another note at least we beat NLs :D

My Characters: Korpsman - 112 Broa Chief Bandit

BulletDreamer 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

:D sairs #1 ohyeah

My Characters: CptJeff - 37 Windia Gunslinger

orangeking11 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

The one in the Big Bang sticky? I only see Shads above NLs on Snails w/o buffs on that one. I think the PB ones are worth looking at (I believe Snails have a PDRate of 10%, PB has a 70%, but most bosses look to have 50%). But the formulas on that chart are very iffy (even the author won't bet on his chart being 100% accurate) and it all comes down to funding. If you look closely, a lot of those gaps in damage are quite small (some being less than a 10% difference) = funding advantage and the new damage range formulas will help "break the chart." xD Edit: And of course, you can't just base whether a class is good or not based on DPM charts - that's just stupid. Like Buccaneers currently don't score top-tier on them now and don't look to do so Post-BB, but they have many nice things about them to balance that out. I wouldn't expect Shads/NLs to score super high either once all the details are assured to be accurate since we both got a lot of good mechanical and non-DPM boosts (45% Shifter at max is just godly and with potentials and the Avoid formula, reaching super high amounts of Avoid is pretty normal. Plus we can pretty much eliminate pot costs in a lot of situations with the shared skill, Dark Flare [example: Grandpa Boss - he just spams 1/1's, so the healing effect will rock for saving pots lol]). xD

My Characters: Orange111 - 145 Broa Night Lord

BulletDreamer 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

Hmm do you guys think there gana put all the content from kmst into gms if not il be sad and disapointed.

My Characters: CptJeff - 37 Windia Gunslinger

orangeking11 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] BulletDreamer : Hmm do you guys think there gana put all the content from kmst into gms if not il be sad and disapointed. [/quote] GMS/NAMS sometimes tweaks content. I think one Aran skill got a reduced damage % when it came over to GMS/NAMS, and I forgot if DBs had any differences too. Shadow Partner for Hermits was also 80% on both Normal Attack and skills on KMS, but 80% and 50% respectively here on GMS/NAMS (post-BB, it's 50% all around, so we GMS/NAMS Hermits/NLs won't notice a difference unless you're using the good ol' Throw 1 Star, 100% damage for 0 MP lol). xD Edit: But I would still be surprised if anything was altered for the Big Bang coming over. xD

My Characters: Orange111 - 145 Broa Night Lord

BulletDreamer 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

Dang so the damage i saw for gunslingers/outlaw/sairs in kmst bb are staying?

My Characters: CptJeff - 37 Windia Gunslinger

j0s3a4d 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

You have to remember that kruimel0's DPS chart does not include Assassinate, or the PP + ME Combo. The PP + ME Combo is going to deal a great deal of Damage Post - Big Bang, and should be part of everyday training as well as bossing.

My Characters: iatLnbandLt - 107 Broa Chief Bandit

sumyounguy 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

The PP+ME won me over for shad in those post BB videos. That was simply amazing seeing pickpocket and meso explosion actually being utilized while fighting normally.

My Characters: OminousDream - 149 Broa Dark Knight

RubberDonkey 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

His chart put shadowers doing bstep instead of assassinate, and buccaneer doing a demoliton+barrage combo (what is this?). Moment I saw that I stopped believing.

My Characters: TrueSlave - 80 Scania Evan 7th Growth

KhainiWest 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

Its because the creator of that chart doesn't know what hes doing.

My Characters: Geminidawn - 165 Khaini Dark Knight

j0s3a4d 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] KhainiWest : Its because the creator of that chart doesn't know what hes doing. [/quote] He knows what he is doing, he just doesn't know how much attack does an uncharged assassinate deals on one Monster, therefore he can't apply Assassinate into the Shadower DPS, he has stated that a couple of times in the comments and even in the DPS chart it says "Will be Higher". Also it is only recently that we know that ME is no longer affected my the amount of Mesos dropped per coin, but only the Damage Range.

My Characters: iatLnbandLt - 107 Broa Chief Bandit

ElderTree + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] RubberDonkey : His chart put shadowers doing bstep instead of assassinate, and buccaneer doing a demoliton+barrage combo (what is this?). Moment I saw that I stopped believing. [/quote] Last I checked (a month or two ago), the Demo + Barrage combo that is in the chart is not as bad as it look at first glance. If you dig into the formulas, you see that he's using the damage of demo for 90% of the time combined with the damage of Barrage for 10% of the time. It is not suggesting that you are constantly alternating between the two. I haven't looked at it since before he threw in Combat Orders, so I don't know if he's correctly adjusted it to be Demo 94% of the time and Barrage 6% or not. As for the shadowers, I believe B-Step by itself outdamages Assassinate by itself. The point being made is that B-Step still has a small delay between the two, and if you fill it with Assassinate between every B-Step, then you can get the optimal damage. Instead of just standing there doing nothing (the small amount of time between B-Steps), you're dealing more damage by wedging a SB or Assassinate in there. Furthermore, since B-Step hits 4 times with Shadow Partner, and PP has a drop rate of 80%, that means it will take 5 B-Steps against a single monster to drop about 16 coins on average. So every 5 B-Steps, you could sneak in another ME and deal a good amount of damage ((180% + 60% from greed) * 15 coins = 3,600% per monster per ME. If SP works with ME, then it goes up to 5,400%!). That should raise the average damage by quite a bit (about 36% more damage overall compared to just spamming B-Step).

My Characters: DarkElm - 110 Yellonde Marauder

RubberDonkey 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] ElderTree : Last I checked (a month or two ago), the Demo + Barrage combo that is in the chart is not as bad as it look at first glance. If you dig into the formulas, you see that he's using the damage of demo for 90% of the time combined with the damage of Barrage for 10% of the time. It is not suggesting that you are constantly alternating between the two.. [/quote] Then shouldn't it be demo/barrage+dragon strike?

My Characters: TrueSlave - 80 Scania Evan 7th Growth

ElderTree 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] RubberDonkey : Then shouldn't it be demo/barrage+dragon strike? [/quote] That... I don't know. That combo may be better, but I don't know much about Barrage Post-BB other than the fact that the % went up, but it lost the 1x1x1x1x2x4x multipliers that it currently has.

My Characters: DarkElm - 110 Yellonde Marauder

furyofdragns 10/06/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

honestly... shadowers are lower because they can't ignore PDrate, and their power cannot overcome the difference.

My Characters: furyofdragns - 129 Broa Dark Knight