I think solo NL vs solo Corsair will be tied in KMS.

basilmarket.com forums : Pirate | 16 posts archived

thread starter SufSurf Jun 18 2010 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

New triple throw formula = 270% each star + new shadow partner with 40% damage = 1134 New battleship cannon = 195% each hit, 6 hits = 1170 (including octopus, would be around 1300?) 1300 + Bullseye = 1560% Assassins new critical throw = 50% of a +10% buff Gunslingers new critical shot = 20% of a +20% buff Having in mind that assassins gets an higher benefit off criticals, and the fact that their critical is better than gunslinger's I'd say its around the same. I'm kinda pissed about this because if you compare them now assassins seems to be better D: They have one or two helpful buffs + faster + good damage both party and solo, while corsairs have no buffs, are freaking slow while on boat and also have a good damage both party and solo. I think it's all coming down to funding, in the end (I was expecting this since they released %stat scrolls) Thoughts?

My Characters: Shaneney - 73 Mardia Priest

pumble02 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

wow corsairs gets downgraded alot and nl just gets decrease shadow partner 10% -.- and even in 3rd job gets decreased. i cant believe cannon is downgraded and rapid fire! even if cannon can hit 6 times id rather see 4 times because its each hit that is high if they split to 6 hits then its chance that the possiblity of some hits being lower such as nl. besides in 3rd job burst of fire is fine but it downgrading. hermits L7 rely on luk meaning that the L7 formula should be also downgraded to make it fair or at least make L7 and TT not based on how much luk but on damage just like anyother class even like archers

My Characters: BagofBuLLets - 95 Broa Outlaw

SufSurf 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] orangeking11 : Yeah, not sure what they're doing with the RF business. -scratches head- xD I like that new Shadow Resistance though. +10% HP is very nice. xD [/quote] Do you have any idea if HP washing is still helpful? o.o I've heard they changed the formulas for acc / avoid and stuff.

My Characters: Shaneney - 73 Mardia Priest

DarkQuill 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

Who CARES who does more damage. Everyone gets a massive damage boost, the enemies will be dead in a single hit from pretty much anything anyway.

My Characters: ShadowQuill - 151 Bera Shadower

frei468 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

It's impossible to tell because they are changing the damage formula for calculating our range. Just throwing out those %'s with no idea on the range for a nl and a sair is going to be changed is useless. If the average range of a nl vary from the average range of a sair, straight %'s don't mean anything.

My Characters: Frei680 - 200 Bera Corsair

SufSurf 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

My Characters: Shaneney - 73 Mardia Priest

iBlaster 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] SufSurf : EDIT: Did anyone else note how they increased Rapid Fire damage on the last balance patch, and now dropped it back? [/quote] Yes I noticed, they even dropped it back even FURTHER than when it wasnt balanced, they also uppgraded BM's hurricane to 130% dmg..... that's really lame -.-" atleast make our rapid fire as strong as BM's hurricane...

My Characters: Liquitech - 129 Bera Corsair

1337Platypus + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

I'm running some calculations right now... Current NL Multiplier, SE and Crit Ring (((150+100+140+10) x .75) + (150 x .25)) x 3 x 1.5 = 1518.75% Post-Stupid-Patch NL Multiplier, SE (nerfed to 110%) and Crit Ring (((270+10+110+10) x .75) + (270 x .25)) x 3 x 1.4 = 1543.5% 1543.5/1518.75 = 1.6% increase for NLs with SE ... >.> Current Cannon Multiplier, SE and Crit Ring ((380+140+10) x .25) + (380 x .75) x 1.2 x 4 = 2004% Post-Stupid-Patch Cannon Multiplier, SE and Crit ring (using SE because Thorns was nerfed to +10% crit rate and +115% crit damage, which is worse than SE) ((195+20+110+10) x .45) + (195 x .55) x 1.2 x 6 = 1857.6% Note: Everything below is an approximation When doing a comparison, mastery nerf has to be taken into account for the Sair: ((0.9 x 0.6) + 1) / 2 = .77 ((0.9 x 0.5) + 1) / 2 = .725 .725/.77 = Damage nerf to about 94% damage, not taking into account STR .94 x 1857.6% = 1746.144 (In actuality the nerf isn't as bad because mastery isn't applied to STR) 30 wep atk increase is like... anywhere from 10% to 20% boost, within reasonable estimates of Sair wep atk (150 total for unfunded, 300 for super-funded with apple) 1746.144 x 1.1 = 1920.7584% 1746.144 x 1.2 = 2095.3728% 2095.3728/2004 = Increase to 105% damage 1920.7584/2004 = Nerf to 95% damage So depending on wep. atk it can either be approximately a 5% increase or a 5% decrease to Sair damage It's essentially balanced, with Sairs getting a 5% increase or decrease and NLs getting a 1.6% increase. Not a drastic change. Based on the current Sair vs. NL calculations, Sairs should still be stronger after the patch, at least in Cannon DPM. However there is a new NL skill I haven't taken into account, because Google translate fails. It probably adds a little more damage to NLs, I don't know. Note: These calculations are based on the assumption that attack speeds, damage range formulas, and TT formula are the same after the patch. It's entirely possible that those values were changed as well.

My Characters: HellDeath - 133 Bera Night Lord

SufSurf + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] 1337Platypus : I'm running some calculations right now... Current NL Multiplier, SE and Crit Ring (((150+100+140+10) x .75) + (150 x .25)) x 3 x 1.5 = 1518.75% Post-Stupid-Patch NL Multiplier, SE (nerfed to 110%) and Crit Ring (((270+10+110+10) x .75) + (270 x .25)) x 3 x 1.4 = 1543.5% 1543.5/1518.75 = 1.6% increase for NLs with SE ... >.> Current Cannon Multiplier, SE and Crit Ring ((380+140+10) x .25) + (380 x .75) x 1.2 x 4 = 2004% Post-Stupid-Patch Cannon Multiplier, SE and Crit ring (using SE because Thorns was nerfed to +10% crit rate and +115% crit damage, which is worse than SE) ((195+20+110+10) x .45) + (195 x .55) x 1.2 x 6 = 1857.6% Note: Everything below is an approximation When doing a comparison, mastery nerf has to be taken into account for the Sair: ((0.9 x 0.6) + 1) / 2 = .77 ((0.9 x 0.5) + 1) / 2 = .725 .725/.77 = Damage nerf to about 94% damage, not taking into account STR .94 x 1857.6% = 1746.144 (In actuality the nerf isn't as bad because mastery isn't applied to STR) 30 wep atk increase is like... anywhere from 10% to 20% boost, within reasonable estimates of Sair wep atk (150 total for unfunded, 300 for super-funded with apple) 1746.144 x 1.1 = 1920.7584% 1746.144 x 1.2 = 2095.3728% 2095.3728/2004 = Increase to 105% damage 1920.7584/2004 = Nerf to 95% damage So depending on wep. atk it can either be approximately a 5% increase or a 5% decrease to Sair damage It's essentially balanced, with Sairs getting a 5% increase or decrease and NLs getting a 1.6% increase. Not a drastic change. Based on the current Sair vs. NL calculations, Sairs should still be stronger after the patch, at least in Cannon DPM. However there is a new NL skill I haven't taken into account, because Google translate fails. It probably adds a little more damage to NLs, I don't know. Note: These calculations are based on the assumption that attack speeds, damage range formulas, and TT formula are the same after the patch... which isn't guaranteed. [/quote] Interesting. Well, why do you call the patch stupid? It will make you very good at soloing. <.<

My Characters: Shaneney - 73 Mardia Priest

puny 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

time to make a NL~

My Characters: punypaly - 141 Windia Aran in Hope

SilverStrato 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

This will shut up all the corsairs.

My Characters: iStratos - 136 Bera Night Lord

Takeback3r + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

Corsairs are still way better than NLs, lmao. The cannon change allows for constant pinning of bosses. The air strike change means corsairs will train way faster than NLs no matter what. The battleship change means more battleship at all times. Summons got buffed, as did the mob skills.

My Characters: BrickwaIker - 162 Khaini Buccaneer

SufSurf + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

@above Couldn't agree more. [quote] SilverStrato : This will shut up all the corsairs. [/quote] This will make Night Lords even cooockier.

My Characters: Shaneney - 73 Mardia Priest

lvanon 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] frei468 : It's impossible to tell because they are changing the damage formula for calculating our range. Just throwing out those %'s with no idea on the range for a nl and a sair is going to be changed is useless. If the average range of a nl vary from the average range of a sair, straight %'s don't mean anything. [/quote] What she said is pure wisdom, right now we just don't know how things will work, also u must consider it's in testpia, so... changes will take place for sure. people have always complained about Corsair being hard to train... now we have the only ultimate atk that can be spamed, since ultimate for mages got cooldown. But as always.... if the new way of Corsairs doesn't suit u... then go make the char that suits u, for me is Corsair all the way, but I still enjoy playing other classes.

My Characters: lvanon - 200 Broa Corsair

1337Platypus 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] Takeback3r : The air strike change means corsairs will train way faster than NLs no matter what. [/quote] No? Avenger only needs to hit 4 targets to outdamage max Air Strike hitting 10 targets. Or 3 targets to outdamage Air Strike hitting 8-9. Also, have fun waiting for the cooldown on low-level Air Strike if you choose to follow an Air Strike training build. Plus, NL solo TT damage will be equal to or better than solo Cannon damage in training situations (as in no bullseye), Avenger will be better than Torpedo, and NLs will of course still be more mobile. Or do I just see things that way because I have too much NL pride? Lol

My Characters: HellDeath - 133 Bera Night Lord

Takeback3r 06/18/10 + PM | QUOTE | PERMALINK | REPORT

[quote] 1337Platypus : No? Avenger only needs to hit 4 targets to outdamage max Air Strike hitting 10 targets. Or 3 targets to outdamage Air Strike hitting 8-9. Also, have fun waiting for the cooldown on low-level Air Strike if you choose to follow an Air Strike training build. Plus, NL solo TT damage will be equal to or better than solo Cannon damage in training situations (as in no bullseye), Avenger will be better than Torpedo, and NLs will of course still be more mobile. Or do I just see things that way because I have too much NL pride? Lol [/quote] What? Avenger hitting 6 targets is 3696% damage. Air strike hitting 10 targets is 6500%. Crits even if they were multiplicative cannot make up that kind of damage difference, not to mention the fact that air strike hits the whole screen and avenger doesn't. What does it matter if it has a cooldown in the earlier levels? Once it's maxed they will train faster than NLs. NLs mobility is a non-issue really. Didn't you know recoil had a reduced delay?

My Characters: BrickwaIker - 162 Khaini Buccaneer